When you meet the, uh... How to put it without spoilers... The Big Floof? You can only either run or shove whoever came with you(dependent on which table you chose at breakfast).
Btw, if you want to know more - get to the lobby after the lights go out in the lodge(Rune's route, for example, gets you there if you choose to go out of the room). Arvo will see a familiar silhouette if you saw the Klaus sub-route.
You follow Klaus, you see him with a huge wolf, you backpedal out of there, no choices there. You get back to the lodge, get help and find the ritual circle, and the wolf finds you - this time you have a choice, you can either just run, or push your companion towards danger first, either way the wolf catches up to you and your companion from the event wakes you up.
Later on, during the lights out event, if you get to the lobby, you meet Dan, a neighboring wolf who came to check up on the lodge. Arvo comments that this wolf's silhouette is familiar. Dan then acknowledges he has already met Klaus - it was him in the woods in the part of the Klaus event that was real. That's what I'm talking about. What are you talking about?
yes, i know this peace. but again I'm talking about the other one, deeper into the Klaus route
(spoiler)
you see Klaus getting into the woods right after supper and decide to run after him. after clearing some of the misunderstandings you arrive at the meadow, to an old grave (with a plate "i walk with a ghosts"). later you can choose to stay at Klaus' instead and if you do become obsessed with him, really. Later you visit Dan with Klaus and he suggests performing some kind of a ritual with evocations in a low deep voice. Klaus wants there to be something beyond our realm so he strives to find it everywhere, this time through low frequencies of sound and our company in a cabin in the woods. he believes he can raise a curtain of this world and find something else, maybe he can even draw ghosts nearby and communicate with them. So during this unfamiliar experience Arvo starts to lose his mind, seeing things
that's what I'm talking about
and there is an option panel, but i have only one choice
so i wondered whether there is another one that i don't know how to create
Okay, what is this? Are you... making fun of me? There isn't a Klaus route, just one event. To pick a route you pick a character at the end of day 1 and he isn't a choice. You simply don't see him outside of breakfast and his one event on day 1.
To my knowledge, there's never an option to follow him again in any of the actual routes, though I can vaguely remember him going into the woods again being mentioned in passing in someone else's route.
Also the screenshot you've shown is missing half the buttons at the bottom. What is this? Some ancient Halloween version?
Well, the author was willing to put in not one, not two, but three intermediate Mikko endings into the game by this point. So it's safe to say there very well might be a universally good ending for them in the final game in a couple of years - Dawn Chorus receives monthly updates for one or two characters at a time, usually moving the plot a day forward for them.
In the meantime, you can read through the comments here for guidance on getting the bad, and the worst intermediate Mikko endings, just to not feel as bad about the ending you've got.
Also, other characters are very well worth your attention as well. But do be warned - the Torulf route is pretty heavy, while the Lake route is absolutely the lightest one. I really recommend playing the Lake route last just to walk away from the game with a positive impression.
Oh wow, what a complete answer, thank you lot!I will play Lake's route and keep in touch with the other characters, again thank you a lot and marry christmas!
I'm very self-conscious, so don't be too vicious, okay? Also, no hate toward the creator or anything.
IF YOU PLAYED THE GAME, YOU WILL UNDERSTAND NOT FOR NEWCOMERS.
It doesn't really contain spoilers, I think.
I deleted my previous post because it was too much, so now I'm just going to sum it up. All the characters are very problematic and are hiding major things, and after falling mostly in love with Arvo, they decide to tell him, for example, Lake, in the shower. I don't know if I'm just dull, but I did not expect what they said. Also, please explain to me how I'm wrong, and this isn't me being sarcastic; I'm just curious about others opinions.
Like Seriously, someone give me a reason to continue playing this game cause I really like it but it just got to be too much for my personal taste like I was shocked to many times.
Are you trying to say I'm a kid because I'm not sure what gave you that impression, and if you say it's my username, that's not a good enough reason? Actually, I see what gave you that impression now that I'm reading what I wrote, but I'm still not a kid.
No there will be, if I recall correctly, but the whole route focuses on the idea of entropy and connection. The outcome of the relationship is wholly dependent on the amount of energy arvo puts in to fixing it.
Right now we are in the rising action of the story heading towards the climax, so it only stands to reason that things arent the best. It's like puberty... It's gotta get worse before it can get better.
We're on day 3 out of 7 and updates keep coming, of course there will be more. As long as there's financial support to the project, that is :p
What comes to the plot...
(spoiler)
I have a feeling it will be about embracing change and living in the present. Their old relationship is finally dead, so they can figure each other out anew and get together as adults.
I'm making a bet we will see Mikko burning at least one of his stupid journals - his obsession with them makes them a perfect Chekhov's gun. He said he didn't bring any physical ones with him but he often lies with a straight face, so ;P
Also I am extremely curious to learn more about his relationship with Joonas. I'll go ahead and make another bet that it fell apart simply because Joonas wasn't Arvo. >:3
I'll probably get downvoted, but I don't like Bjorn's route. It's clearly underdeveloped - it's almost entirely linear and has Arvo acting on his own without your input.
Also I just don't feel the chemistry between the two.
It's like... Bjorn is just being sad and barely saying anything, and Arvo's like "Omg omg omg, a bear! I want to cuddle him! I'm so horny!". Seriously, everyone else in every route has a game on. Bjorn does not, but Arvo is falling head over heels for him, it feels weird to me.
Bjorn needs a friend, not a fuckmate, what are you doing, Arvo? :\
I guess I understand what you're saying, but I'm not sure I agree with it. Obviously you're entitled to your opinion, and I find it an interesting perspective nonetheless.
I like Bjørn. I find him compelling because he reminds me of a lot of people I've met in my own life. His struggles with responsibility and desire, I think are rather relatable to, at least where I'm from, the general culture surrounding ones dreams and aspirations.
I disagree that they don't have any chemistry. Bjørn is a creative individual, a dreamer, an artist just like Arvo, but his creativity is being stiffled by his depression, his fear of failure, and of course his feelings of responsibility and obligation to his parents and to their future. He believes, in some respect, that he must earn the life that they gave him a chance at by achieving something great. He's drowning in the never-ending problem he's trying to face because he's not cut out for the field he believes would make his parents happy. Bashing his head against a brick wall, expecting it to break instead of finding another path out.
Arvo is also a dreamer and an artist. He desires to capture the beauty in the world around him, and because of his different upbringing from that of the bear, he holds the belief that he can achieve his dreams, but is stiffled by his fears of not being good enough. Stifled by his fears of messing up. Stifled by his fears of mediocrity. We see examples of this in a lot of different routes, but in this route we see a specific example in his conversation with Guðrun about photography where he admits to himself that he's lost the meaning of photography that he was originally striving for.
I think when Arvo looks at Bjørn, in some respect, he sees himself. In addition to that, Bjørn, just like Arvo, is extremely lonely. The whole route is focused on the idea of inhibitions, what they are, what they mean, and finding a balance between responsibility to others and to yourself.
But I don't really see how any of the things you've mentioned could be a basis for the extremely rapidly blooming romance of this route, when none of them were portrayed or used in this manner. They were good reasons to become friends though.
I think the chemistry you're seeing in this route is actually entirely inside your head this time(and maybe you and the author are on the same wavelength about this) - to me it's obvious the plot is missing some key developments between "we're chatting about studying" and "we're cuddling half-naked under a blanket".
Though I don't know what we're even arguing about here, the route is literally underdeveloped, you can't even derail it if you try, and I tried.
It has my favorite interaction with Lake though! Jealous Lake! Or maybe I'm the one reading too deep into it this time.
After the game night, regardless of whether you visited it or not, you won't be present for the power outage. So at the supper Lake goes: "too bad we didn't have you there :C I have to talk you into staying with us next time. So what did you do?" - "Stayed with Bjorn". Lake, without moving a face muscle, looks up at Bjorn, who has been towering over them like the Eye of Sauron the entire time: "Oh hi, Bjorn, didn't see you there." xD Yeah, right. And then Lake's like "Oh well, gotta go!" and skedaddles to avoid drilling a hole in Bjorn with a jealous look. He's such a sweet idiot, I wish there were options to derail other routes for Lake :3
Oh, I don't think we are arguing. In fact, I do agree that it develops rather quickly—when I first played the route, I was surprised at the speed at which they connected—and I can see what you're saying in regards to being underdeveloped.
There are even inconsistencies with plot points and exposition as well. Maybe the author just hasn't had time to do a clean up like he's done for other routes in the past.
I suppose I came off as though I thought it was a perfect route, but it isn't and that wasn't my intent.
Nono, I didn't mean it like fighting-arguing, more like discussing-arguing. People sometimes forget the word "arguing" comes from the word "argument", and think of it as screaming at each other in futile rage - that's not the meaning I intended :p
You have been a very nice companion to discuss this VN with, I very much enjoy your company and opinions and hope we will get to keep discussing it all the way to its full release =)
for me it was weird that whether you romance him or befriend him comes from a choice to drink or not to drink, and if you drink you automatically suck him off later that night. but if you don't drink there is basically no romance, just two friends hugging in an underwear, providing physical touch to each other which is great
Okay, I feel genuinely singled out here. I am an aspiring musician who reads and practices a ton philosophy, works out a lot and enjoys working myself half to death (sometimes). Rune's route is one I really connect with on a personal level. Lake is perfect, but Rune is literally me.
By the way (if it's no bother to you), could you tell me what you mean by life being 'linear'? That's the kind of stuff I like to sit, think and have an existential crisis about sometimes.
Yeah, this author has a real penchant for creating very realistic characters that remind players of real people. Though you might be the first one to admit one of the characters is literally you.
Also, I haven't seen the author reply here, but you can start talking about things you found interesting and someone surely will join. Which route was that stuff about the linearity of life in? Rune's?
In Rune’s we mention it while on the roof with him. Also in Mikko’s route he mentions how ‘non linear’ his life feels. I’m guessing he’s saying that he feels as though he’s defied any kind of predestination in his life, but I could be mistaken.
Right, so, in Rune's roof scene Arvo is thinking about non-linearity in a whimsical way that isn't supposed to make much sense, I think - he's just experiencing a case of deja-vu, feeling the same way he did long time ago, that sense of inspired hope for the future and closeness to someone he mutually appreciates, as if the life looped back on itself and the same moment happened twice.
And... I don't quite remember what Mikko said about non-linearity. Could you remind me when he said it so I can double-check?
It was Arvo both times. He just said kinda the same thing to Mikko as he did to Rune. You might be right, he could be talking about the purpose and meaning of memories in our lives; timelines folding in on themselves as our minds bring up the events of moments passed in the present, affecting our current actions and thoughts, though the moments themselves are gone forever. That's quite cool to think about actually.
I personally love Lake's bursts of philosophically fatalistic mood. "You can suddenly just die, everything you have can be lost", and I'm like: "I just had supper, who starts a conversation like this?
Torulf is a horrible person, and that's how it's supposed to be. I'll put the rest under a spoiler.
His route is an exploration of the complicated topic of abuse that young people are often subjected to and how internalized and normalized this has become in our society. It just wouldn't work if he was a genuinely good person and Arvo was freaking out over nothing.
I understand the topic is heavy and not at all enjoyable, which is probably not what you were looking for in a visual ovel. I have some complicated feelings about it too. But please try to understand that the Torulf route is the most nuanced and complicated one in the entire VN and there's a reason why people want more of it.
Also, you don't need to hate on it, after the next update, you won't see another Torulf update for more than half a year.
Then again, it's pretty obvious he is going to play some role in other routes. Probably not one as dramatic, but still.
Lake's route is definitely the fluffiest so far—I hope that it stays that way—but I do think that all of the routes, even though they are sad, are sweet, poignant, and even fluffy in their own ways.(Except, at this current juncture, Torulf's route, which I believe the author will at some point turn around to a positive. I find it hard to believe that they don't have a plan since all of their writing is so purposeful.)
Certain characters are surely going to play bigger roles in each other's routes.
Mikko and Torulf are obvious candidates. Torulf is left lonely and restless in Lake's route, and Mikko's story can't remain unresolved just because Arvo chose to chase a different tail.
Here's to hoping the cute little wolf won't go full old bad ending on anyone.
Well, Devon's route speaks to a positive relationship with Mikko. He seemed genuinely happy for Arvo, and had seemingly found the resolution to the pain he had been holding on to, even going so far as to say that they had both become different people and that that was okay.
I was actually doing Bjorn's route when Mikko sidetracked me and I was like "Oh what the hell, might as well play his route instead". And then you find the key and get a choice to sleep in your room, and I thought: "Well I haven't done that before, might as well see how it plays out" and five minutes later I'm looking at the title screen, my jaw on the floor.
Do whatever you want during the first day, but choose Mikko when deciding who to stay with, and in a bit you will find your key, while taking a photo with Bjorn and Mikko. Go to your own room, don't change your mind, and you will get the Worst Mikko Endind :(
No, because it's the common room - you can't freak out about people being in your space, when you are in a public place.
But also yes, because Torulf was being inappropriate.
But also no, because it's weird to be possessive of a friend like he's your boyfriend.
But also yes, since Mikko and Arvo's relationship is complicated and they kind of were flirting, just in their own low-key way. Which means Torulf was actually stepping on Mikko's game and that's a major faux pas.
It's a complicated situation for sure, and I suppose we, as readers, have a different perspective on both Mikko's and Arvo's mindsets about each other that they don't have, but if I was just a friend even, I would feel very uncomfortable with a random guy coming in and flirting with my close, childhood friend. Especially if I thought he had bad intentions for them.
But then again, you're right about your prior points against it.
Honestly really great update. I'm excited to see where it goes from here. Mostly I'm excited to see which choice is the, "correct," one.
It was pretty powerful. We tend to get so caught up in the story—as is the case with the best writing—that we oft times will feel what Arvo is feeling and I think his pain came through in the update just as much as Devon's did.
I know! I wonder where they’ll take the story! After I finished I had to take a moment to reflect on all of the emotions the characters were processing. The choice Arvo has to make is a tough one, so I can’t wait to see how they end up handling it!
For reals! I'm trying not to get too spoilery, but its hard to tell which one is the, "Right," choice. Because on the one hand—how about let's keep it vague—Choice one seems like it would be the, "right," choice, but there's no telling how Devon would react to said decision, and choice two could just as easily garner the desired outcome from Devon if he comes to certain choices on his own.
I thought it was really cool how we got to chill on his perspective for so long. That was really interesting. Just like the Mikko update. :')
Nothing but a sad, hurt person hiding behind a façade. His fear of confronting his true emotions and fears has closed him off from others and himself, so he's the master of his own undoing. Others are unfortunate collateral damage.
I hope he gets to redeem himself at one point by facing himself. If not, well... Yet another story of emotional abuse by a vulnerable narcissist, one told too many times.
I don't like him. He reminds me of too many people I've known... I shall spare you the details, but it sufficeth to say he's a narcissist and Although I will likely finish the line I will do so with much trepidation
I agree. I think that the character they made is flawlessly written to the point that both my empathy for the hollow, hole-ridden soul of the abuser and the damage they must have endured to become that way and my utter disgust at their actions are triggered simultaneously.
Major trigger for me, but nonetheless astounding writing.
Judging by the fact you're asking this question, probably the same thing as you - he is a shallow cynical manipulative bastard abusing naive young boys. What a great character! I hate him! =)
It wont let me play this new update, it came up with a file that my antivirus was blocking me from downloading the game, then when I deal with said file the game wont even load up. How do I fix this??
In the settings of antivirus add file\folder of game to exception of scanning\monitoring. You can find instructions in google like "how to add file in exception in {antivirus name}"
God this game is intense. I've played the routes of Mikko, Jørgen, and Torulf. Loved all of them, but Torulf's was especially tough to get through (in a good way kind of).
Also, I've already met Guðrún from my second playthrough with Jørgen, but seeing her again in Torulf's route and going through each and every choice to see her new dialogue made me really happy. I love her and I hope I'll get to see her more in future possible routes!
I also headcanon her as trans right now because she really gives me that vibe (and I'm a trans woman and I find myself really attached to her). I could definitely be wrong but it's a nice thought.
I'm not a fan of how ham-fisted Gudrun's appearance is in Torulf's route if you don't do anything on the first night. After playing spin the bottle, she just appears out of nowhere at dinner and decides she's your friend now.
"What's your number? Where do you live?", and she voices her opinions about someone she's never met... It made me feel really uncomfortable and not at all friendly towards her, but Arvo just... goes with it? Without my input? :(
It feels awkward and uncomfortable, I hope this gets reworked. I don't understand why she even needs to make an appearance here, we already have plenty of characters who would be perfect to talk this out with.
And her appearance if you stop seeing Torulf is... Same question, really - why is she there at all? Why can't you run into just Bjorn? Or literally any other of your friends? She just hijacks the plot and you get no say anymore, I hate that. I hope this gets changed, the next Torulf update is upon us, after all!
p.s. Also she's kinda mean to Lake in Jorgen's route, so, I'm generally not a fan of her.
Downloaded for gay furries stayed for the music references. Godspeed You! Black Emperor and Tangerine Dream were nice sure but the Telefon Tel-Aviv reference had me in stitches! Even went the extra mile to change it for a different Israeli city
But jesus christ, the author has been hurt by someone.
p.s. The entire Torulf route and bar ending are genuinely horrifying. Or maybe they are only horrifying to me because something like that happened to me. Being taken advantage of and abused while you're helplessly dying inside is no fun and I'm still shaken a whole day after playing that route because it put me back in that mindspace of being cynically used.
Someone nice doesn't equal someone good, kids. Stick to your own age pool when dating.
Man. I've gone from a Lieutenant to a monkey living in Germany when I hardly know English or German. I haven't even seen my girlfriend in two years. I'm hoping that god doesn't allow me to wind up like this fellow, but chances are, if I'm on here, I don't really have much hope anyway
That’s true, but things aren’t easy to get by when you’re Russian and you’re associated with the military. Most understand that I left long before the current conflict, but some still desperately try to inflate their fragile ego by insulting others. But, I can’t complain; Britain and Germany are by far the best countries that were available, and I managed to get in a good one. If I ended up in Georgia or America, It’d be pretty damn hard to make do.
TL;DR: It's basically the rape route. Just because Arvo does it all willingly doesn't make it better - he was taken advantage of and manipulated into those actions.
Torulf spent his youth working and making money, then realized he lost something he will never be able to get back - the excitement of exploring his sexuality in that tender age he left behind.
So now he's compensating himself by stealing that experience from young trusting boys. He is nice, and gentle, and generous, but this is just a way to lure people like Lake and Arvo into doing something they don't really want to. They want to be seen, and felt, and loved, but he's substituting it for lust and keeping them at a hand's length, never truly giving them what they want, making them suffer, while having all the fun he wants with them.
Mikko sees right through Torulf, because he is mentally more developed and experienced than Arvo and Lake combined - he had his heart crushed before, he's been in a relationship, and no doubt he had people hit on him only being interested in some action. He quickly figured out Torulf doesn't need anything more than leeching love and adoration from the boys who don't know any better.
At the moment of the bar scene, Arvo is in love with Torulf, and Lake hates himself and is afraid to be alone again.
Lake came to terms with his situation, persuading himself this is the best he can do, content to be Torulf's fucktoy, but he recognizes the situation Arvo is in, since he's been there himself not so long ago. Arvo thinks he is in a relationship with Torulf, but he is just a toy.
Lake feels horrible for Arvo and wishes he could explain it all, but he doesn't have the strength, he is afraid to lose what little good grace he has with Torulf, so he just sits there, watching Arvo dying inside, feeling like shit about it. Meanwhile Arvo doesn't understand why Torulf is openly hitting on Lake in front of him, driving home the point that having Arvo isn't enough for Torulf, that what they had meant nothing to him. Arvo is dying a thousand deaths in that bar scene and so is Lake. All while Torulf is having the time of his life, playing with two cute boys who can't say no to him.
Torulf route could be even more on the nose only if he actually raped Lake and Arvo, but there was never any need for that, he poisoned them with adoration for him, tied them to himself in a way no rope ever could, and now does whatever he wants with their bodies. This is vile and truly horrifying in how manipulative and cynical it is.
Having been in this situation myself, I must say it was described almost beat by beat how I experienced it, though in real life there was more time between events. Going through the experience Lake and Arvo did feels like becoming dirty under your skin, dirty in a way you will never be able to wash off. I heard actual rape victims describe their experience this way and I'm not surprised.
But i have others doubts about that ending. like what is the meaning of the scene when Arvo was with Torulf in the flower field and Torulf last words were "praise"?
The flower field means nothing on its own, it's just a dreamy background, and any symbolism you might find in it would be forced, it's just artistic choice and nothing more.
Praise is what Torulf wants - he didn't get enough love when he was younger and now he feels like the world owes him all the love he can get his paws on, no matter who gets hurt in the process, since in his eyes, its his to take, with nothing owed in return. He wants, he NEEDS for people to want him, to crave him, to love him.
Torulf is a horrible person who hurt himself in his shallowness, and is now trying to drown his own fear of coming to terms with his reality by piling young bodies on it.
BTW, this is pure assumption, but since the author has been so thorough when writing Torulf, I imagine I can make it. Torulf is coming on to Arvo so hard precisely because Mikko rebuffed him. You can' imagine how hard it hurts people like him when someone doesn't want them, it's a knife wound on their world - someone dares to keep from him what he deserves, something that he imagines he owns, and there's nothing he can do about it. So of course he rushed to put another body onto the pile and fuck Arvo - he needed to distract himself from the defeat.
Honestly, one of my favorite VN's I've ever played. There's romance, there's tension, there's drama... I love how each story builds and grows as it progresses. I can't wait to see how each character's story arc finishes! And the art is amazing too. I am particularly intrigued by Rune, Mikko, and Torulf's stories, but all of them are fantastic in their own ways.
Spoilers from Mikkos Route! AND SORRY WRITING SO MUCH
A lot of people seem annoyed at the "Bad ending" of Mikkos Route, but I think I have somewhat of a different take here, I personally don't like to attach to the past, I find it kinda toxic, so when I saw that an old best friend was out there in the romance options, I just avoided him and played every other route first and left Mikko for last, and as I got to know him first by the others routes, It kinda creeped me out how petty and obsessive he seemed to be, he's fixated on us, in a unique toxic way, and I kinda disliked him for that.
So when I played his route I couldn't help to see the red flags of someone who felt powerless, he had to move from home because of you, he lost all his friends because of you, and then as soon as you come back, he changes himself to please you, (you can even see his inner thoughts, he's really obssesed to please you!).
And from what I get from all the other routes, is that he didn't move on from you after all this years, and even if you didn't either, at least you're trying. He remembers every single detail of those days with you because he wrote all of those same details on a diary that he STILL reads years later, repeating all of those events like mantras, and despises you for not remembering those days as well as he does now. I was SO creeped out until the end.
And... since I played all the others routes first, I dettached from him as a character, but if you do that, you can start to perceive all this toxic form of attachment he's formed with the idea of you.
I really like the "Bad ending" because it makes a lot of sense for his character, you're kinda the Torulf on his life, and by choosing to re-attach to Mikko instead of moving on with the other routes and characters, you're awakening all this trauma that he had to endure, bringing the worst in him.
In my personal opinion, that's why both of his endings are bad, because the only way of giving HIM a good ending is by not choosing him on the first place.
Spectacular writing! Kudos to the creator for giving us the opportunity to get to know a character through other routes, instead of just writing him off or ignoring his existence, as many other writers would do.
For me the issue isn't that there isn't a good ending but rather that the aggressiveness of it was pretty out there. You're definitely right about the red flags though, especially when you consider the first bad end you can get in Mikko's route.
I don't completely agree that Arvo is his Torulf though. I guess from Mikko's perspective, sure. The shit that happened was like in junior high I think it was mentioned. While shit can carry with us I highly doubt that's the kind of trauma that would create such a sadistic method of dealing with shit. What's more likely is that something way worse happened afterward (the mentioned boyfriend maybe?). Then Arvo comes along and he tried desperately to cling to something positive but ultimately uses Arvo as an easy punching bag instead (Arvo is kind of a push-over).
It should also be noted that Arvo had tried to avoid Mikko for the most part. Sure it was ultimately his choice when the key goes missing but Mikko was the one who tried to reconnect first. I don't think it's fair to blame Arvo for relenting to reconnect, especially when he's clearly not good at seeing red flags. I could see why you would feel awkward about Mikko's route being a route but in Arvo's perspective at the choice, this is him reconnecting with a friend not choosing a romantic partner.
That said though. We don't know the details on other things and his behavior throughout are signs of a very unhealthy person. It will take a lot to turn the route around and have it not be toxic and if I were in place of Arvo I wouldn't even try after the blow up (And get the police involved in terms of the bad ending). I'm gonna say it, Mikko is a bad dog! Bad dog!
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Finally got around to playing, fun game
hey guys
i wonder if someone knows, but is there option available at Klaus' ritual other than running away? and if there is maybe you can give a tiny hint
yeah, most people talk about Devon's route development and here i am pulling the dead out of their grave
When you meet the, uh... How to put it without spoilers... The Big Floof? You can only either run or shove whoever came with you(dependent on which table you chose at breakfast).
Btw, if you want to know more - get to the lobby after the lights go out in the lodge(Rune's route, for example, gets you there if you choose to go out of the room). Arvo will see a familiar silhouette if you saw the Klaus sub-route.
nahh, i mean the ritual delirium, not the lobby delirium
with a bass amplifier, to put it subtle
Okay, this is getting entirely too cryptic.
(spoiler)
You follow Klaus, you see him with a huge wolf, you backpedal out of there, no choices there. You get back to the lodge, get help and find the ritual circle, and the wolf finds you - this time you have a choice, you can either just run, or push your companion towards danger first, either way the wolf catches up to you and your companion from the event wakes you up.
Later on, during the lights out event, if you get to the lobby, you meet Dan, a neighboring wolf who came to check up on the lodge. Arvo comments that this wolf's silhouette is familiar. Dan then acknowledges he has already met Klaus - it was him in the woods in the part of the Klaus event that was real. That's what I'm talking about. What are you talking about?
yes, i know this peace. but again I'm talking about the other one, deeper into the Klaus route
(spoiler)
you see Klaus getting into the woods right after supper and decide to run after him. after clearing some of the misunderstandings you arrive at the meadow, to an old grave (with a plate "i walk with a ghosts"). later you can choose to stay at Klaus' instead and if you do become obsessed with him, really. Later you
visit Dan with Klaus and he suggests performing some kind of a ritual with evocations in a low deep voice. Klaus wants there to be something beyond our realm so he strives to find it everywhere, this time through low frequencies of sound and our company in a cabin in the woods. he believes he can raise a curtain of this world and find something else, maybe he can even draw ghosts nearby and communicate with them. So during this unfamiliar experience Arvo starts to lose his mind, seeing things
that's what I'm talking about
and there is an option panel, but i have only one choice
so i wondered whether there is another one that i don't know how to create
Okay, what is this? Are you... making fun of me? There isn't a Klaus route, just one event. To pick a route you pick a character at the end of day 1 and he isn't a choice. You simply don't see him outside of breakfast and his one event on day 1.
To my knowledge, there's never an option to follow him again in any of the actual routes, though I can vaguely remember him going into the woods again being mentioned in passing in someone else's route.
Also the screenshot you've shown is missing half the buttons at the bottom. What is this? Some ancient Halloween version?
i went through every route and I didnt see this?!
Right? It's a derailment route, which means you must start a different route and then switch to this one.
To get it...
1. Get a coat on day 1(either talk to Rune before losing the key, or ask Devon for help when you lost it)
2. Do the Klaus event when given chance on the first day. Make sure you talk to him and follow him all the way into the woods.
3. After that follow...
3.a) the Bjorn route, in which case just wait till you get a chance to chase after Klaus into the woods again.
3.b) the Devon route, in which case don't help him with telescopes and talk to Klaus in the cafeteria.
"neutral mino hotel" and "the asterioplane over the sea"
I see what you did there
I fucking love Devon. (Is there a love rout for him like the others?)
Yes
thank goodness
Arvo and Mikko will have a good ending? Like, together? :(
Well, the author was willing to put in not one, not two, but three intermediate Mikko endings into the game by this point. So it's safe to say there very well might be a universally good ending for them in the final game in a couple of years - Dawn Chorus receives monthly updates for one or two characters at a time, usually moving the plot a day forward for them.
In the meantime, you can read through the comments here for guidance on getting the bad, and the worst intermediate Mikko endings, just to not feel as bad about the ending you've got.
Also, other characters are very well worth your attention as well. But do be warned - the Torulf route is pretty heavy, while the Lake route is absolutely the lightest one. I really recommend playing the Lake route last just to walk away from the game with a positive impression.
Oh wow, what a complete answer, thank you lot!I will play Lake's route and keep in touch with the other characters, again thank you a lot and marry christmas!
How do I not sleep on day one for Torulfs route?
I'm very self-conscious, so don't be too vicious, okay? Also, no hate toward the creator or anything.
IF YOU PLAYED THE GAME, YOU WILL UNDERSTAND NOT FOR NEWCOMERS.
It doesn't really contain spoilers, I think.
I deleted my previous post because it was too much, so now I'm just going to sum it up. All the characters are very problematic and are hiding major things, and after falling mostly in love with Arvo, they decide to tell him, for example, Lake, in the shower. I don't know if I'm just dull, but I did not expect what they said. Also, please explain to me how I'm wrong, and this isn't me being sarcastic; I'm just curious about others opinions.
Like Seriously, someone give me a reason to continue playing this game cause I really like it but it just got to be too much for my personal taste like I was shocked to many times.
See, this is why the game warns you it's not for children.
Are you trying to say I'm a kid because I'm not sure what gave you that impression, and if you say it's my username, that's not a good enough reason? Actually, I see what gave you that impression now that I'm reading what I wrote, but I'm still not a kid.
is there something wrong with everything going in a game not like how you expected it to go? i think it's cool to be surprised about other characters
Im very curious about mikkos route. Played it and well,, i liked it but if my guts are correct, there wont be a happy ending for them ?
No there will be, if I recall correctly, but the whole route focuses on the idea of entropy and connection. The outcome of the relationship is wholly dependent on the amount of energy arvo puts in to fixing it.
Right now we are in the rising action of the story heading towards the climax, so it only stands to reason that things arent the best. It's like puberty... It's gotta get worse before it can get better.
We're on day 3 out of 7 and updates keep coming, of course there will be more. As long as there's financial support to the project, that is :p
What comes to the plot...
(spoiler)
I have a feeling it will be about embracing change and living in the present. Their old relationship is finally dead, so they can figure each other out anew and get together as adults.
I'm making a bet we will see Mikko burning at least one of his stupid journals - his obsession with them makes them a perfect Chekhov's gun. He said he didn't bring any physical ones with him but he often lies with a straight face, so ;P
Also I am extremely curious to learn more about his relationship with Joonas. I'll go ahead and make another bet that it fell apart simply because Joonas wasn't Arvo. >:3
Nice theatre reference. I approve.
are you sure about it being Day 3 out of 7? pretty sure it's 5 total, hence why Keo talks about being over 50% from time to time
Obviously Keo knows better, but isn't it said in the game the science camp is supposed to be a week long?
Thank you. Im looking forward to it :)
I keep going to play Mikko's route again, and then end up getting sidetracked by Bjørn. I just love him so much. 👏🥺
I'll probably get downvoted, but I don't like Bjorn's route. It's clearly underdeveloped - it's almost entirely linear and has Arvo acting on his own without your input.
Also I just don't feel the chemistry between the two.
It's like... Bjorn is just being sad and barely saying anything, and Arvo's like "Omg omg omg, a bear! I want to cuddle him! I'm so horny!". Seriously, everyone else in every route has a game on. Bjorn does not, but Arvo is falling head over heels for him, it feels weird to me.
Bjorn needs a friend, not a fuckmate, what are you doing, Arvo? :\
I guess I understand what you're saying, but I'm not sure I agree with it. Obviously you're entitled to your opinion, and I find it an interesting perspective nonetheless.
I like Bjørn. I find him compelling because he reminds me of a lot of people I've met in my own life. His struggles with responsibility and desire, I think are rather relatable to, at least where I'm from, the general culture surrounding ones dreams and aspirations.
I disagree that they don't have any chemistry. Bjørn is a creative individual, a dreamer, an artist just like Arvo, but his creativity is being stiffled by his depression, his fear of failure, and of course his feelings of responsibility and obligation to his parents and to their future. He believes, in some respect, that he must earn the life that they gave him a chance at by achieving something great. He's drowning in the never-ending problem he's trying to face because he's not cut out for the field he believes would make his parents happy. Bashing his head against a brick wall, expecting it to break instead of finding another path out.
Arvo is also a dreamer and an artist. He desires to capture the beauty in the world around him, and because of his different upbringing from that of the bear, he holds the belief that he can achieve his dreams, but is stiffled by his fears of not being good enough. Stifled by his fears of messing up. Stifled by his fears of mediocrity. We see examples of this in a lot of different routes, but in this route we see a specific example in his conversation with Guðrun about photography where he admits to himself that he's lost the meaning of photography that he was originally striving for.
I think when Arvo looks at Bjørn, in some respect, he sees himself. In addition to that, Bjørn, just like Arvo, is extremely lonely. The whole route is focused on the idea of inhibitions, what they are, what they mean, and finding a balance between responsibility to others and to yourself.
So... Yeah... Sorry for the essay.
Nono, that's why I'm here!
But I don't really see how any of the things you've mentioned could be a basis for the extremely rapidly blooming romance of this route, when none of them were portrayed or used in this manner. They were good reasons to become friends though.
I think the chemistry you're seeing in this route is actually entirely inside your head this time(and maybe you and the author are on the same wavelength about this) - to me it's obvious the plot is missing some key developments between "we're chatting about studying" and "we're cuddling half-naked under a blanket".
Though I don't know what we're even arguing about here, the route is literally underdeveloped, you can't even derail it if you try, and I tried.
It has my favorite interaction with Lake though! Jealous Lake! Or maybe I'm the one reading too deep into it this time.
After the game night, regardless of whether you visited it or not, you won't be present for the power outage. So at the supper Lake goes: "too bad we didn't have you there :C I have to talk you into staying with us next time. So what did you do?" - "Stayed with Bjorn". Lake, without moving a face muscle, looks up at Bjorn, who has been towering over them like the Eye of Sauron the entire time: "Oh hi, Bjorn, didn't see you there." xD Yeah, right. And then Lake's like "Oh well, gotta go!" and skedaddles to avoid drilling a hole in Bjorn with a jealous look. He's such a sweet idiot, I wish there were options to derail other routes for Lake :3
Oh, I don't think we are arguing. In fact, I do agree that it develops rather quickly—when I first played the route, I was surprised at the speed at which they connected—and I can see what you're saying in regards to being underdeveloped.
There are even inconsistencies with plot points and exposition as well. Maybe the author just hasn't had time to do a clean up like he's done for other routes in the past.
I suppose I came off as though I thought it was a perfect route, but it isn't and that wasn't my intent.
Nono, I didn't mean it like fighting-arguing, more like discussing-arguing. People sometimes forget the word "arguing" comes from the word "argument", and think of it as screaming at each other in futile rage - that's not the meaning I intended :p
You have been a very nice companion to discuss this VN with, I very much enjoy your company and opinions and hope we will get to keep discussing it all the way to its full release =)
for me it was weird that whether you romance him or befriend him comes from a choice to drink or not to drink, and if you drink you automatically suck him off later that night. but if you don't drink there is basically no romance, just two friends hugging in an underwear, providing physical touch to each other which is great
i still like this route personally
Agreed on all accounts. Here's hoping we get a general touch up at some point soon. Its still one of my favorite routes though.
sometimes it just works out that way, very realistic fr fr
Okay, I feel genuinely singled out here. I am an aspiring musician who reads and practices a ton philosophy, works out a lot and enjoys working myself half to death (sometimes). Rune's route is one I really connect with on a personal level. Lake is perfect, but Rune is literally me.
By the way (if it's no bother to you), could you tell me what you mean by life being 'linear'? That's the kind of stuff I like to sit, think and have an existential crisis about sometimes.
Thank you for making! 5 stars from me.
Yeah, this author has a real penchant for creating very realistic characters that remind players of real people. Though you might be the first one to admit one of the characters is literally you.
Also, I haven't seen the author reply here, but you can start talking about things you found interesting and someone surely will join. Which route was that stuff about the linearity of life in? Rune's?
In Rune’s we mention it while on the roof with him. Also in Mikko’s route he mentions how ‘non linear’ his life feels. I’m guessing he’s saying that he feels as though he’s defied any kind of predestination in his life, but I could be mistaken.
Right, so, in Rune's roof scene Arvo is thinking about non-linearity in a whimsical way that isn't supposed to make much sense, I think - he's just experiencing a case of deja-vu, feeling the same way he did long time ago, that sense of inspired hope for the future and closeness to someone he mutually appreciates, as if the life looped back on itself and the same moment happened twice.
And... I don't quite remember what Mikko said about non-linearity. Could you remind me when he said it so I can double-check?
It was Arvo both times. He just said kinda the same thing to Mikko as he did to Rune. You might be right, he could be talking about the purpose and meaning of memories in our lives; timelines folding in on themselves as our minds bring up the events of moments passed in the present, affecting our current actions and thoughts, though the moments themselves are gone forever. That's quite cool to think about actually.
I personally love Lake's bursts of philosophically fatalistic mood. "You can suddenly just die, everything you have can be lost", and I'm like: "I just had supper, who starts a conversation like this?
Poor Rune. I wish he had it better
I hope this is still in development this is great storytelling I just wish Torulf wasn't such a ASSHOLE but maybe he will become a better person.
edit: I also hope Mikko gets a true happy ending
(fersona 4 xd)
Is that a persona reference!?
couldn't agree much more
i need more mikko PLEASE
The text of this is truly beautiful QQ
The plot is also fantastic and intricate.
Want to know more about Torulf's past😃
less torluf would be better
Torulf is a horrible person, and that's how it's supposed to be. I'll put the rest under a spoiler.
His route is an exploration of the complicated topic of abuse that young people are often subjected to and how internalized and normalized this has become in our society. It just wouldn't work if he was a genuinely good person and Arvo was freaking out over nothing.
I understand the topic is heavy and not at all enjoyable, which is probably not what you were looking for in a visual ovel. I have some complicated feelings about it too. But please try to understand that the Torulf route is the most nuanced and complicated one in the entire VN and there's a reason why people want more of it.
Also, you don't need to hate on it, after the next update, you won't see another Torulf update for more than half a year.
Then again, it's pretty obvious he is going to play some role in other routes. Probably not one as dramatic, but still.
Didnt mean to hate y`k Just meant to say that Imo less torluf would be better
Agreed
I CAN FIX HIM
Wait can I play it on iOS or ipad
yeah just downloaded the Ios one.
Ty
THIS IS SO GOOD I CANT WAIT FOR MORE LAKE UPDATES😭😭😭😭
Lake route is the heart bleach. It's something to replay after getting burned on other routes.
Devon: Depression, oppression, and loneliness.
Bjorn: Depression, pressure, social anxiety, and loneliness.
Rune: Depression, anxiety, and burn-out.
Jorgen: Depression, social pressure, and repression.
Torulf: Self-deprication, fear of commitment, manipulation, and abuse.
Mikko: Social anxiety, unhealthy co-dependence, and Toxic internalized trauma obsession.
Lake: Silly cats hugging and feeling loved UwU
Lake's route is definitely the fluffiest so far—I hope that it stays that way—but I do think that all of the routes, even though they are sad, are sweet, poignant, and even fluffy in their own ways.(Except, at this current juncture, Torulf's route, which I believe the author will at some point turn around to a positive. I find it hard to believe that they don't have a plan since all of their writing is so purposeful.)
Certain characters are surely going to play bigger roles in each other's routes.
Mikko and Torulf are obvious candidates. Torulf is left lonely and restless in Lake's route, and Mikko's story can't remain unresolved just because Arvo chose to chase a different tail.
Here's to hoping the cute little wolf won't go full old bad ending on anyone.
Well, Devon's route speaks to a positive relationship with Mikko. He seemed genuinely happy for Arvo, and had seemingly found the resolution to the pain he had been holding on to, even going so far as to say that they had both become different people and that that was okay.
But, yeah. I'm with you, lol.
HELPPP WHATT I ONLY DID LAKE'S ROUTE
i guess i make great choices...
Oh cool, there's a third Mikko ending.
Return to your room after finding the key and Arvo straight up fucking DIES.
Yes, on day 1. Dawn Chorus Speedrun WR Any%
So there's a bad ending, a worse ending, and THE WORST.
Tbh, I wish it had a perspective switch to Mikko, just dying didn't hurt enough.
I
Is this REAL??
I'm testing it.
It freaking IS! I was petrified when I found it!
I was actually doing Bjorn's route when Mikko sidetracked me and I was like "Oh what the hell, might as well play his route instead". And then you find the key and get a choice to sleep in your room, and I thought: "Well I haven't done that before, might as well see how it plays out" and five minutes later I'm looking at the title screen, my jaw on the floor.
how get it, im mad confused wtf
Do whatever you want during the first day, but choose Mikko when deciding who to stay with, and in a bit you will find your key, while taking a photo with Bjorn and Mikko. Go to your own room, don't change your mind, and you will get the Worst Mikko Endind :(
Я не дождусь переводов на свой язык, а уже столько обновлений вышло..
в ВК канале ExGames должны быть переводы большинства фурри визуальных новелл, насколько я помню. эта тоже должна быть.
Man, i Downloaded this game for nsfw, but then got so addicted to lakes path that i didnt care about nsfw anymore, this game.. is really. nice
Update 1:
I keep On replaying his Path every day, he remind me of my significant other, I kinda see myself in arvo boots. Great Job Author. Great job.
Lake... i need more lake... our cute Non-binary Lion i need more..
Man The Emotional attachment.
Bro i got emotional for this game, i was literally cries in the shower
the Torulf update is gona be relesed on my bday :3 yipeeeee!
Am I the only one that thought Mikko's reaction to Torulf when he interrupted Arvo and his conversation in the common room was justified?
Asking for a friend... 👀
I want to say yes and no?
No, because it's the common room - you can't freak out about people being in your space, when you are in a public place.
But also yes, because Torulf was being inappropriate.
But also no, because it's weird to be possessive of a friend like he's your boyfriend.
But also yes, since Mikko and Arvo's relationship is complicated and they kind of were flirting, just in their own low-key way. Which means Torulf was actually stepping on Mikko's game and that's a major faux pas.
It's a complicated situation for sure, and I suppose we, as readers, have a different perspective on both Mikko's and Arvo's mindsets about each other that they don't have, but if I was just a friend even, I would feel very uncomfortable with a random guy coming in and flirting with my close, childhood friend. Especially if I thought he had bad intentions for them.
But then again, you're right about your prior points against it.
Y’all can we please talk about the lates Devon update! I think I was just stabbed in the feels…
Honestly really great update. I'm excited to see where it goes from here. Mostly I'm excited to see which choice is the, "correct," one.
It was pretty powerful. We tend to get so caught up in the story—as is the case with the best writing—that we oft times will feel what Arvo is feeling and I think his pain came through in the update just as much as Devon's did.
We'll see.
I know! I wonder where they’ll take the story! After I finished I had to take a moment to reflect on all of the emotions the characters were processing. The choice Arvo has to make is a tough one, so I can’t wait to see how they end up handling it!
For reals! I'm trying not to get too spoilery, but its hard to tell which one is the, "Right," choice. Because on the one hand—how about let's keep it vague—Choice one seems like it would be the, "right," choice, but there's no telling how Devon would react to said decision, and choice two could just as easily garner the desired outcome from Devon if he comes to certain choices on his own.
I thought it was really cool how we got to chill on his perspective for so long. That was really interesting. Just like the Mikko update. :')
Everyone, I need your opinions.
What do you think about Torluf?
Nothing but a sad, hurt person hiding behind a façade. His fear of confronting his true emotions and fears has closed him off from others and himself, so he's the master of his own undoing. Others are unfortunate collateral damage.
I hope he gets to redeem himself at one point by facing himself. If not, well... Yet another story of emotional abuse by a vulnerable narcissist, one told too many times.
I don't like him. He reminds me of too many people I've known... I shall spare you the details, but it sufficeth to say he's a narcissist and Although I will likely finish the line I will do so with much trepidation
It's a compliment to the author that your thoughts instantly jump to all the real bastards you've met when interacting with Torulf - it's spot-on.
I am confident he's a portrait of someone the author knew personally, or possibly an amalgam of several real bastards.
For reals.
I agree. I think that the character they made is flawlessly written to the point that both my empathy for the hollow, hole-ridden soul of the abuser and the damage they must have endured to become that way and my utter disgust at their actions are triggered simultaneously.
Major trigger for me, but nonetheless astounding writing.
Torulf is sweet then boderline scary at the end
Judging by the fact you're asking this question, probably the same thing as you - he is a shallow cynical manipulative bastard abusing naive young boys. What a great character! I hate him! =)
he sucks, he is straght up a asshole, who just uses others for pleasure.
he's a messy bitch who hit rock bottom and kept digging. really interested in where his character is going. it's gotta get worse before it gets better
Y'all... be honest... which one did you choose for the new update?
One or two, for the sake of avoiding spoilers?
Made a save instead, so I can experience both sides.
That's totally fair. I'm obviously gonna play both as well.
It wont let me play this new update, it came up with a file that my antivirus was blocking me from downloading the game, then when I deal with said file the game wont even load up. How do I fix this??
In the settings of antivirus add file\folder of game to exception of scanning\monitoring. You can find instructions in google like "how to add file in exception in {antivirus name}"
I have attempted to do that still refuses to allow me to play
The 3D map that has been used for the backgrounds looks really good. If it is available anywhere, it would be nice to explore it in VR!
God this game is intense. I've played the routes of Mikko, Jørgen, and Torulf. Loved all of them, but Torulf's was especially tough to get through (in a good way kind of).
Also, I've already met Guðrún from my second playthrough with Jørgen, but seeing her again in Torulf's route and going through each and every choice to see her new dialogue made me really happy. I love her and I hope I'll get to see her more in future possible routes!
I also headcanon her as trans right now because she really gives me that vibe (and I'm a trans woman and I find myself really attached to her). I could definitely be wrong but it's a nice thought.
Here's hoping there shall be more Guðrún content!
I'm not a fan of how ham-fisted Gudrun's appearance is in Torulf's route if you don't do anything on the first night. After playing spin the bottle, she just appears out of nowhere at dinner and decides she's your friend now.
"What's your number? Where do you live?", and she voices her opinions about someone she's never met... It made me feel really uncomfortable and not at all friendly towards her, but Arvo just... goes with it? Without my input? :(
It feels awkward and uncomfortable, I hope this gets reworked. I don't understand why she even needs to make an appearance here, we already have plenty of characters who would be perfect to talk this out with.
And her appearance if you stop seeing Torulf is... Same question, really - why is she there at all? Why can't you run into just Bjorn? Or literally any other of your friends? She just hijacks the plot and you get no say anymore, I hate that. I hope this gets changed, the next Torulf update is upon us, after all!
p.s. Also she's kinda mean to Lake in Jorgen's route, so, I'm generally not a fan of her.
do not leave me on a cliff hanger with jorgens route puhLEAAASEEE 😭
is there some official\unofficial discord server of this game? can someone give a link?
If v0.34 was a Sesame Street episode:
" Today's update is bought to you by the letter 'douchebag'. "
I really hope the choice at the end doesn't have a impact to the story, and if it does, please be a good impact!!🥺🥺
Ugh such a good update! Loved every second of it!!✨✨❤️❤️
(Devons route) oh that was a nice film, NOOOOOOOOO! NOT THE MUSIC FROM THE MIKKO ROUTE!!!! NOOOOOO! I'M GONA CRY! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA ;-;
my virus software stop opening the zip file for pc due to a detected threat in newest update
So peaceful yet so cute and hot at the same time, Mikko needs to watch himself with his behaviour a bit tho
Downloaded for gay furries stayed for the music references.
Godspeed You! Black Emperor and Tangerine Dream were nice sure but the Telefon Tel-Aviv reference had me in stitches! Even went the extra mile to change it for a different Israeli city
someone have a guide to unlock mikko bad endings?
Just don't follow him outside when he says he has plans. That's enough to switch to the bad route.
I thought it was just a cute VN.
Some routes are even cute.
But jesus christ, the author has been hurt by someone.
p.s. The entire Torulf route and bar ending are genuinely horrifying. Or maybe they are only horrifying to me because something like that happened to me. Being taken advantage of and abused while you're helplessly dying inside is no fun and I'm still shaken a whole day after playing that route because it put me back in that mindspace of being cynically used.
Someone nice doesn't equal someone good, kids. Stick to your own age pool when dating.
Man. I've gone from a Lieutenant to a monkey living in Germany when I hardly know English or German. I haven't even seen my girlfriend in two years. I'm hoping that god doesn't allow me to wind up like this fellow, but chances are, if I'm on here, I don't really have much hope anyway
That’s true, but things aren’t easy to get by when you’re Russian and you’re associated with the military. Most understand that I left long before the current conflict, but some still desperately try to inflate their fragile ego by insulting others. But, I can’t complain; Britain and Germany are by far the best countries that were available, and I managed to get in a good one. If I ended up in Georgia or America, It’d be pretty damn hard to make do.
What happens in that ending ? Can you tell me? Because i already saw it but i don't understand it
tldr is under the spoiler
TL;DR: It's basically the rape route. Just because Arvo does it all willingly doesn't make it better - he was taken advantage of and manipulated into those actions.
Torulf spent his youth working and making money, then realized he lost something he will never be able to get back - the excitement of exploring his sexuality in that tender age he left behind.
So now he's compensating himself by stealing that experience from young trusting boys. He is nice, and gentle, and generous, but this is just a way to lure people like Lake and Arvo into doing something they don't really want to. They want to be seen, and felt, and loved, but he's substituting it for lust and keeping them at a hand's length, never truly giving them what they want, making them suffer, while having all the fun he wants with them.
Mikko sees right through Torulf, because he is mentally more developed and experienced than Arvo and Lake combined - he had his heart crushed before, he's been in a relationship, and no doubt he had people hit on him only being interested in some action. He quickly figured out Torulf doesn't need anything more than leeching love and adoration from the boys who don't know any better.
At the moment of the bar scene, Arvo is in love with Torulf, and Lake hates himself and is afraid to be alone again.
Lake came to terms with his situation, persuading himself this is the best he can do, content to be Torulf's fucktoy, but he recognizes the situation Arvo is in, since he's been there himself not so long ago. Arvo thinks he is in a relationship with Torulf, but he is just a toy.
Lake feels horrible for Arvo and wishes he could explain it all, but he doesn't have the strength, he is afraid to lose what little good grace he has with Torulf, so he just sits there, watching Arvo dying inside, feeling like shit about it. Meanwhile Arvo doesn't understand why Torulf is openly hitting on Lake in front of him, driving home the point that having Arvo isn't enough for Torulf, that what they had meant nothing to him. Arvo is dying a thousand deaths in that bar scene and so is Lake. All while Torulf is having the time of his life, playing with two cute boys who can't say no to him.
Torulf route could be even more on the nose only if he actually raped Lake and Arvo, but there was never any need for that, he poisoned them with adoration for him, tied them to himself in a way no rope ever could, and now does whatever he wants with their bodies. This is vile and truly horrifying in how manipulative and cynical it is.
Having been in this situation myself, I must say it was described almost beat by beat how I experienced it, though in real life there was more time between events. Going through the experience Lake and Arvo did feels like becoming dirty under your skin, dirty in a way you will never be able to wash off. I heard actual rape victims describe their experience this way and I'm not surprised.
ok thanks for explain it.
But i have others doubts about that ending. like what is the meaning of the scene when Arvo was with Torulf in the flower field and Torulf last words were "praise"?
The flower field means nothing on its own, it's just a dreamy background, and any symbolism you might find in it would be forced, it's just artistic choice and nothing more.
Praise is what Torulf wants - he didn't get enough love when he was younger and now he feels like the world owes him all the love he can get his paws on, no matter who gets hurt in the process, since in his eyes, its his to take, with nothing owed in return. He wants, he NEEDS for people to want him, to crave him, to love him.
Torulf is a horrible person who hurt himself in his shallowness, and is now trying to drown his own fear of coming to terms with his reality by piling young bodies on it.
BTW, this is pure assumption, but since the author has been so thorough when writing Torulf, I imagine I can make it. Torulf is coming on to Arvo so hard precisely because Mikko rebuffed him. You can' imagine how hard it hurts people like him when someone doesn't want them, it's a knife wound on their world - someone dares to keep from him what he deserves, something that he imagines he owns, and there's nothing he can do about it. So of course he rushed to put another body onto the pile and fuck Arvo - he needed to distract himself from the defeat.
Honestly, one of my favorite VN's I've ever played. There's romance, there's tension, there's drama... I love how each story builds and grows as it progresses. I can't wait to see how each character's story arc finishes! And the art is amazing too. I am particularly intrigued by Rune, Mikko, and Torulf's stories, but all of them are fantastic in their own ways.
Spoilers from Mikkos Route! AND SORRY WRITING SO MUCH
A lot of people seem annoyed at the "Bad ending" of Mikkos Route, but I think I have somewhat of a different take here, I personally don't like to attach to the past, I find it kinda toxic, so when I saw that an old best friend was out there in the romance options, I just avoided him and played every other route first and left Mikko for last, and as I got to know him first by the others routes, It kinda creeped me out how petty and obsessive he seemed to be, he's fixated on us, in a unique toxic way, and I kinda disliked him for that.
So when I played his route I couldn't help to see the red flags of someone who felt powerless, he had to move from home because of you, he lost all his friends because of you, and then as soon as you come back, he changes himself to please you, (you can even see his inner thoughts, he's really obssesed to please you!).
And from what I get from all the other routes, is that he didn't move on from you after all this years, and even if you didn't either, at least you're trying. He remembers every single detail of those days with you because he wrote all of those same details on a diary that he STILL reads years later, repeating all of those events like mantras, and despises you for not remembering those days as well as he does now. I was SO creeped out until the end.
And... since I played all the others routes first, I dettached from him as a character, but if you do that, you can start to perceive all this toxic form of attachment he's formed with the idea of you.
I really like the "Bad ending" because it makes a lot of sense for his character, you're kinda the Torulf on his life, and by choosing to re-attach to Mikko instead of moving on with the other routes and characters, you're awakening all this trauma that he had to endure, bringing the worst in him.
In my personal opinion, that's why both of his endings are bad, because the only way of giving HIM a good ending is by not choosing him on the first place.
Spectacular writing! Kudos to the creator for giving us the opportunity to get to know a character through other routes, instead of just writing him off or ignoring his existence, as many other writers would do.
spoiler reply
For me the issue isn't that there isn't a good ending but rather that the aggressiveness of it was pretty out there. You're definitely right about the red flags though, especially when you consider the first bad end you can get in Mikko's route.
I don't completely agree that Arvo is his Torulf though. I guess from Mikko's perspective, sure. The shit that happened was like in junior high I think it was mentioned. While shit can carry with us I highly doubt that's the kind of trauma that would create such a sadistic method of dealing with shit. What's more likely is that something way worse happened afterward (the mentioned boyfriend maybe?). Then Arvo comes along and he tried desperately to cling to something positive but ultimately uses Arvo as an easy punching bag instead (Arvo is kind of a push-over).
It should also be noted that Arvo had tried to avoid Mikko for the most part. Sure it was ultimately his choice when the key goes missing but Mikko was the one who tried to reconnect first. I don't think it's fair to blame Arvo for relenting to reconnect, especially when he's clearly not good at seeing red flags. I could see why you would feel awkward about Mikko's route being a route but in Arvo's perspective at the choice, this is him reconnecting with a friend not choosing a romantic partner.
That said though. We don't know the details on other things and his behavior throughout are signs of a very unhealthy person. It will take a lot to turn the route around and have it not be toxic and if I were in place of Arvo I wouldn't even try after the blow up (And get the police involved in terms of the bad ending). I'm gonna say it, Mikko is a bad dog! Bad dog!